By Duncan Scott Davidson. Read Duncan's BMX Battles article here. Read his interview with pro biker Ian Schwartz here.
Chris McMahon, occasionally referred to in the bike scene as “Beerman,” due to an unfortunate high school football coach, runs www.sjbmx.com. His take on bikes being a “menace” in skateparks is that it’s not bikes, per se, it’s little kids who don’t know what they’re doing, don’t have park etiquette, and are essentially abandoned at the skatepark by parents who don’t want to pay for babysitters.
McMahon, wiped out from Dawg Aid. Photo by Daniel Porter
SFBG: What are you doing?
CHRIS McMAHON: Ah, not much. Out riding right now.
SFBG: Right on. Sorry to interrupt the session.
CHRIS: It’s cool. I actually have to help my buddy with a flat tire.
SFBG: Bike or car?
CHRIS: Bike.
SFBG: Bike? And he needs help?
CHRIS: He just needs a pump.
Footy from sjbmx.com. This includes clips from Cityview skatepark in Alameda, which BMXers helped design and pay for, but were later shut out of.
SFBG: I went to the Dawg Aid thing at Stonegate that you guys put on. There was, of course, a ton of bikes there. Was that originally a “no bike” park?
CHRIS: It definitely was and still is a “no bike” park, but we’ve never had it enforced. Never, ever gotten kicked out of there, to the best of my knowledge.
SFBG: What about Plato Arroyo?
CHRIS: We used to get kicked out of there. I know there’s still a rule, but I haven’t seen anyone get kicked out of there in awhile. There’s kids that ride there every day. But, that Evelyn lady that’s in my email, she was out there the other day. I don’t know what she was doing, exactly, but I have a feeling they’re going to be putting a fence up to keep bikes out. I talked to her about that a couple of years ago, and she never got around to getting back to me.
SFBG: In terms of Lake Cunningham, when did meetings start going down about that?
CHRIS: About the design?
SFBG: Sort of. When did they start designing it, and when did bikers get involved?
CHRIS: I think they started designing it about two years ago, maybe it was two and a half. They had an initial meeting, which no riders went to, because we weren’t informed. Two months after that, they had the initial design meeting, which I found out about just because I was looking around for information on skateboard message boards online. I got the date and time and location, and got a few guys to go to that.
SFBG: When was that?
CHRIS: I don’t remember exactly when it was, but I’m positive it was early 2006, maybe. Or maybe middle 2006. It was awhile ago. They were talking about how they didn’t really want to get bikes in there. Whoever the guy is who is in charge of the district for Stonegate was complaining about bikes in the park being a major problem, which is funny, because that’s the only people who ever rode there up, up until recently. Now there’s a lot of skaters there because they want to get used to bigger trannies for the Cunningham park.
SFBG: So who was giving the most anti-bike statements at these meetings, and where did they get their information from?
CHRIS: That’s a great question. Well, that Evelyn lady that works for the city, she was definitely anti-bike from the beginning. I don’t know what her deal is exactly now, maybe she’s reformed. But they seem to be getting their information from Zach Wormhoudt. He’s the guy who designed the Cunningham park. He’s like a professional skatepark designer. He’s did Stonegate. I think he did the Benicia park where I’m at right now. That one’s got bikes allowed.
SFBG: I hear it’s mostly bikes a lot of times.
CHRIS: Yeah. Right now there’s more riders than there are skaters, which is different from when I’m normally here.
SFBG: Basically, Wormhoudt’s take on parks is that they’re just for skateboards and not for bikes?
CHRIS: Well, it’s weird. He seems to not have a problem with bikes, but he goes with whatever the skaters in the area’s opinion is.
SFBG: He was at these meetings?
CHRIS: Yeah, well he’s the head designer, so he was giving his little Powerpoint presentation or whatever.
SFBG: And the local skaters were at the meeting?
CHRIS: Yeah, there was some young skaters, and there were some older hessian types, who were pretty much totally anti-bike. You know, they want their pool coping everywhere. Bikes do damage pool coping, I’ll give them that. It’s all a matter of whether you put pool coping everywhere. Which isn’t the smartest thing to do if you want to allow bikes.
SFBG: So the old guys were saying that the bikes were going to damage the pool coping, what were their other claims about bikes?
CHRIS: Well, they have the, “bikes do different lines.” Have you ever read the article in Thrasher, the “BMX Jihad” one? They were basically doing that sort of stuff. They weren’t actually saying too much at the meeting, because it was a design meeting, and not actually a park hours or use meeting, but they were doing the typical “the park’s designed for skateboards. A bike can hurt somebody if it runs into you.” Which, you know, is true, but when a biker falls, the bike pretty much stays there, but when a skateboard, you know--they go flying all over the place.
SFBG: Yeah, and just the fact that bikes take different lines doesn’t mean there necessarily has to be collisions. Skaters collide with each other too.
CHRIS: Yeah. It’s really just a dumb argument on their part, but the city listens to it because there’s a lot more skaters than there are bikers, and a lot more of them are homeowners and whatnot. We don’t really too many homeowner riders, and there are easily ten or fifteen times as many of them as there are us.
SFBG: When you’re out riding, like right now in Benicia or at street spots, do you think the whole anti-bike battle is increasing or decreasing? How do you see that?
CHRIS: Honestly, the way I see it, is most skaters don’t really have a problem with bikes unless they get snaked by a bike. Or, they’re a pool coping skater type. Most of the time I’ll go ride all over the place and I don’t get vibed at all. But occasionally, you go and try to ride Sunnyvale, which, you know, we’re not allowed into, and the skaters there will say, “Don’t grind anything! You’re gonna fuck up the coping and fuck up the cement.” If you don’t do it, they’re fine, but if you touch that coping once, they get really pissed.
SFBG: And this is metal coping or pool coping?
CHRIS: At Sunnyvale it’s steel coping with, I think, 4000 PSI concrete.
SFBG: What are pegs gonna do to steel coping?
CHRIS: You know how people do peg chinks and that sort of shit? It can dent it. Here’s what happens: most riders are fairly smooth when it comes to grinding. Some of the kids who don’t know what the hell they’re doing--you’ve got your hucker types who are just smashing into shit all over the place--they instantly associate every biker with that. So it’s basically because there’s just some people who either don’t know what the hell they’re doing, or they’re more--I don’t want to say “aggressive,” but they’re just more tough on the coping. So they think we’re all like that. The thing is, for the Cunningham park, they’re requiring plastic pegs anyway. That’s going to be softer on coping than an aluminum skateboard truck.
SFBG: That’ll actually make pool coping faster--it’ll put a sheen on it.
CHRIS: Yeah, exactly. They’re not letting us ride any of the pools with pool coping there, though.
SFBG: What do you think of making parks either no pegs or plastic pegs, or the park pegs with aluminum on the end?
CHRIS: I have a pair of the plastic pegs. I’d never ride them on the street, but I don’t mind swapping them out to ride a park. I was up in Oregon a week and a half ago and they have plastic peg cover rules up there at there park. I was like, “Okay--I’m just going to run the plastics then.” I didn’t have any problems at all. Nobody said anything.
SFBG: Those parks are bike legal?
CHRIS: Yeah, but they require you have plastic pegs. Actually, it was kind of funny--I was at the Ashland park and, you know, they’ve got their helmet rules. The bowls are pretty gnarly, so we were wearing our helmets and our pads and whatnot, and a ranger shows up and kicks out every skater out. Of course, no skater wears a helmet or pads. That’s the first time I’ve actually seen that. He didn’t care that we were there because we had are plastic pegs and weren’t bonkin’ the shit out of anything, and we had our helmets on, so he was just sitting there, chillin’, waiting for the skaters to come back so he could write them tickets.
SFBG: What do you think about the new Lake Cunningham park being only two hour sessions?
CHRIS: That drives me nuts. If the times were better it wouldn’t bother me so much. But the times they have now, it’s practically impossible for anybody to ride there, except on a Sunday. ‘Cause they have 11 to 1 on Sunday, and you have to pay $2 to ride for $2 hours, and the skaters have all day to ride there, every day, pretty much. Pretty much every park in the Bay Area.
SFBG: Can they ride during bike sessions, or is it bike only?
CHRIS: It’s bike only. I think it’s kind of silly, because if they’re not going to let us ride the pool coping, they might as well let the old school skaters ride the pool coping area.
SFBG: Do you think, in terms of collisions, that if they just let bikes into parks, skaters will get used to the way bikers ride and the collisions will go down anyway?
CHRIS: Maybe. It depends. I think at Cunningham it’d probably be better, but they’re probably judging on what they see at Plato Arroyo. Which, you get a lot of kids. You’ve got skaters and kids on skateboards, you know? And then you’ve got bikers and kids on bikes. And the bikers and skaters know what they’re doing. And then you’ve got the kids who are just cutting across the lines, not looking where they’re going, just smashing into people. I was there when that Evelyn lady was at Plato Arroyo last week, and I told everybody to chill out. We keep our eyes really open, we can look really good for this lady. And not two minutes later, this little ten-year-old kid on some piece of shit Toys-R-Us bike comes cutting across the park diagonally and runs into some equally young skater kid who doesn’t know what he’s doing. So, it makes everybody look bad.
SFBG: The complaint I’ve heard is that parents just use these places like daycare.
CHRIS: Totally. Totally. Plato Arroyo kind of sickens me, because parents will just drop their kids off there, no parental supervision at all. And they’re just going around getting in the way. Occasionally they get ran into. And it’s gonna happen because the fact they don’t know what they’re doing. A kid that young shouldn’t be in a skatepark--they should be in a parking lot.
SFBG: Do you think there should be some kind of rule--I hate to suggest new rules--that maybe kids under a certain age should have parental supervision.
CHRIS: Yeah, I totally agree that kids under a certain age should have supervision. At the Benicia park on Saturday morning, they have young kid only hours.
SFBG: That’s a great idea.
CHRIS: I asked one of the city people if they’re going to do that at Cunningham, and they said, “No. We don’t have any plans to do that.” Which is fine, because it’s just going to be only the skaters together and the bikers together separate. There’s not going to be any crossing lines. But still, I bet you you’re going to see, that first day, there’s gonna be a ton of collisions between kids and older people. It might not be much of an issue at Cunningham because you have to pay. You’re not going to get as many irresponsible parents going there. It’s only two bucks, but why would they go there when they could bring their kid to Plato Arroyo and skate for free? Not to mention Cunningham is a lot bigger, so it’s probably likely to scare some parents. They’re not going to think, “Oh, that’s cute.”
SFBG: What do you think the origin of the Bikers vs. Skaters thing is?
CHRIS: You know, I have no idea. Especially now. Because you know, most skaters will actually get stoked when a biker does something. And when a skater actually pulls something, a biker will get stoked. If I see a kid do something cool, I’m gonna be, “Good job.” But I think part of it is, there’s so few of us and a lot of us put a lot of effort into it. I don’t know if this is the right way to put it, but a lot of times bikers just land everything. I remember that was a big complaint in that stupid article in Thrasher. People make shit look really, really easy. You put in your practice and you get your stuff done. Because on a bike, you’re going down with the ship. You have to commit to it, unless you’re doing a select few things where you can let go an it’ll be fine. Whereas on a skateboard, you go up to a skatepark, and you’ll see 50 kids out there on skateboards, and they’re all trying kickflips on the flat and never actually trying to commit to it. I don’t know if it’s just them getting pissed at us because we’re there and we’re different. I think a lot of it just has to do with us making it look a lot easier than it is, and them seeing it as inferior because of that.
SFBG: What positive things can BMXers do to counter that attitude?
CHRIS: Well, the first thing that we can do is, you know, a lot of times you get a skater hating on you, and a biker will do something stupid, like say something or trying to fight the guy or something. That just makes us look bad every single time.
SFBG: Do you think that when skaters vibe bikers, bikers usually want to brawl? Or the other way around?
CHRIS: Not necessarily brawl. I honestly think it’s the other way around a lot of times. We’ve had some instances at Sunnyvale where a bike will go in and will take one run, and a skater who, honestly, sucks, but wants to look cool in front of his buddies will get up in the bikers face and put his trucks up above his head and whatnot, like he’s gonna smack him with his trucks. But that doesn’t happen that often. Normally it’s just a lot of vibing and calling the cops. I think that one of the funny things is, skateboarding used to be about doing something different. It used to be more underground and counterculture. It’s not anymore. Everybody knows what a skateboarder can do and has seen it on TV. They’ve got their video games, they’ve got Tony Hawk, they’ve got their skateparks they can skate whenever they want. And now we’re in the situation that they were in the ‘80s. We’re not allowed to ride. They’re the establishment. They want to keep us from doing our thing.
SFBG: Do they call the cops a lot?
CHRIS: At Sunnyvale, yeah. At a lot of other parks, no. It depends on the park and whether you’re a local or not. For example, at the Hayward park, there’s a ranger out there who’s just a complete douchebag. I’ve seen him ticket eight-year-old skaters for not wearing helmets. Which is…who does that? That guy calls the cops every time he goes out there. But he’s not a skater, he’s just a ranger. But it really does just depend on the park. At Alameda they’re used to us. At Benicia, obviously they’re not going to call the cops because we’re allowed. You never get it at Stonegate or any of the San Jose parks, but if you went into that new Santa Cruz park… It’s another one of those Wormhoudt parks. If you went in there, if you didn’t get beat up, you’d definitely get the cops called on you. And Sunnyvale, like I said, they will call the cops on you. And if not them, somebody who works at the park--the dude driving the lawnmower.
SFBG: We had this ten-year-old kid at Redwood City call the cops on us one time.
CHRIS: Yeah, exactly. Some of these kids are clueless. But what bothers me is, when the cops come… Most kids are going to ride their bikes or their skateboards because it’s something to do. And it’s good because, they might not be playing baseball or some traditional sport, but they’re doing something that’s keeping them from doing drugs, and it’s keeping them from joining a gang, and it’s keeping them entertained and whatnot. And then the cops come and they kick the bikes out, and if you can’t ride, what are you going to do? You’re going to do one of those things that you’re not supposed to be doing.
SFBG: Or you’re going to change to skateboarding because you can get into places.
CHRIS: Or that, too. But you don’t see too much of that. Because once you’ve been kicked out because of a skater calling the cops, you don’t want to actually join them. It’s like turning traitor. Not to mention all your friends ride bikes.
SFBG: I skate as well. I just started skating again after a long lay off. It’s funny about what you were saying about skaters being the establishment, because when I was in high school, I skated ditches and stuff with my friends all the time, and we’d always get kicked out and busted by the cops for skating. There was that whole “Skateboarding Is Not A Crime” sticker. And now, I ride most of the time, and you go to parks, and the first person to call the cops on you is a skateboarder. That’s my exact argument--they used to be anti-establishment, now they are the establishment. They used to be anti-cop.
CHRIS: Now they don’t have any problem with them. ‘Cause they’re not getting in trouble. I’m trying to think of something that would be the equivalent of that.
SFBG: It’s kind of like any political power struggle. When the revolutionary becomes the government, shit changes a lot. I just think it’s funny that these kids grow up--they’re basically born into these parks now. They want to keep that rebellious attitude and look, but they’ve never been kicked out of anywhere for skating.
CHRIS: You’ve got parents that treat it like little league. They’re trying to live vicariously through their children. It kind of drives me nuts to see that. You occasionally get the dad who comes out who’s never skated in his life who comes out. He’s wearing like full pads and a helmet. He’s trying to be cool and skate with his kid, but he’s really just getting in the way of everyone else at the park. I mean, yeah--it’s cool that you’re trying to skate, but learn how to do it in a parking lot. It’s like, when I learned how to ride a bike, I was on an empty basketball court or on the sidewalk--I didn’t learn how to do it in a skatepark. I learned how to skateboard in my driveway before I went over to the skatepark.
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Comments (7)
A word of caution:
Zack Wormhoundt was asked by the Tempe City Council (in Arizona) his opinion on allowing bikes in the Tempe Skatepark. I believe he lied to the city council, telling them that bikes would damage the park beyond repair. Bikes do cause wear and tear on skateparks, and so do skateboards. All skateparks need maintenance. Neither user group causes "damage". It should be considered normal wear and tear.
Also, Colby Carter, a known bike-hater, is designing for California Skateparks now. If California Skateparks is being considered to design any new skatepark, make sure your city officials know of his bias. E-mail me through my website, www.psychicflyingmonkey.com, for information on Colby Carter.
Posted by psychicflyingmonkey![[TypeKey Profile Page]](http://www.sfbg.com/blogs/gsf/nav-commenters.gif)
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June 6, 2008 09:53 PM
The following is an op-ed piece the Arizona Republic asked me to write on the bikes in skateparks issue. It ran in the Republic a little over a year ago:
BMX bike riders need legal places to ride. Within the past year, many Arizona cities have recognized this, and have chosen to either build new bikeparks, or allow bikes in their new or existing skateparks.
When a city builds a bikepark, it is only half the solution. Even if the bikepark is right next to a skatepark, skateboarders will inevitably want to skate it. It’s new terrain. It’s like building two golf courses side by side and telling golfers they can only golf one of the courses. So the severe enforcement issue arises. Police and park rangers will begin chasing, macing, ticketing and arresting skateboarders for skating the bikepark, just as they have done to bike riders for riding skateparks.
When a city allows bikes in their skateparks, they are undoing a segregation that never should have been installed in the first place. BMX riders and skateboarders rode together and got along just fine in private skateparks for over 20 years before the public skatepark boom started in the late nineties, during which cities banned bikes from their skateparks. Taxpayer money is saved because there is no need to aggressively enforce a ban on any skatepark user. Moreover, cities can save hundreds of thousands of dollars by allowing bikes in their skateparks instead of building a brand new bike park. They just get more bang for their skatepark buck.
Skateparks are far and away the most used public recreation facilities nowadays. You can almost never find one empty at any time of day, while you can easily find an empty tennis court or softball field. Ultimately, bike riders and skateboarders need to work together to get cities to keep building bigger and more co-mingled bike and skate facilities until none are overcrowded.
Jason Ryan
President
The Bike, Blade and Board Coalition
Bike riders need to work hard to get new parks built. We have expended much effort to get new parks that allow all users here in Arizona, and the skaters have recognized our efforts. Unfortunately, is our great shame that the bmx media cares so little about inspiring and urging kids to take action on this issue in the rest of the nation instead of sitting and whining about it. For example, Ryan Fudger, Associate Editor of Ride BMX, probably the biggest BMX magazine in the world, has known about virtually every step we've taken to get legal places for bikes to ride in Arizona, yet he has almost entirely ignored it in the magazine. We have also had prominent Arizona bike riders such as KC Badger work AGAINST us, influencing kids not to help with our efforts because it's "not cool".
How pathetic.
God bless Duncan for writing such a thorough exploration of this issue. Keep up the good work!
To watch a segment I created about protests we held at skateparks in Arizona, visit http://www.psychicflyingmonkey.com/films.htm and download "When Others are Oppressed, The Bikes in Skateparks Protest Segment". I need to update the segment, as Reed Skatepark in Mesa now does allow co-mingled use by skaters and bike riders at all times. Also check out The 3BC page on my site as well. It contains logs of all our efforts with many cities in Arizona.
Stay tuned to www.psychicflyingmonkey.com for info on my full-length documentary of the "Bikes in Arizona Skateparks" movement that is now in production.
Posted by psychicflyingmonkey![[TypeKey Profile Page]](http://www.sfbg.com/blogs/gsf/nav-commenters.gif)
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June 6, 2008 09:55 PM
Good article and comments, but you folks should check the facts before you make claims about things that might make a differnce to you.
The truth is a City and the City's Insurance Provider determine if bikes will be allowed in parks, not the park designer. And it is true that more often than not bikes have gotten an unfair assessment by these people.
If a concrete park has steel coping (pipe and bent plate) on all of the exposed concrete edges it should be structurally durable enough for skate and bike use. If edges are exposed w/o coping then they will be damaged by skate and bike use> but worse by bikes. Those are the facts like it or not.
Our office has professional bike riders we work with on a regular basis. We encourage bike use in parks when a City will allow it. We have designed some of the best know concrete bike parks in the US> Louisville, Benicia, Lake Cunningham, and Mosqueda (in fresno> bike only concrete).
Frustration with not being able to use all of the skate parks out there is one thing, but to blame the park designers for the park rules is only going to further limit your places to ride.
If you want the the facts about any paticular park we have worked on or have any questions about how to help get bikes in equal access to parks give us a call.
Zachary Wormhoudt
Wormhoudt Incorporated
849 Almar Avenue, Suite 280
Santa Cruz, CA 95060 USA
t_831_426_8424
www.skateparks.com
Posted by Zach Wormhoudt | June 9, 2008 11:31 AM
Hello, Wormhoudt. I am pleased to see that you have deemed the comments on this article worthy of your presence. Most skatepark designers run and hide like snakes when confronted with actual facts about bikes in skateparks. You’ve posted and I hear you talking, but you’re talking directly out of your sphincter. Some skaters may worship you, but I think you’re worthless as a bag of assholes and twice as funky.
So you claim that you support bike use in your skateparks when the city will allow it. No one would know that from your website, now would they? Out of 53 minutes of video featuring park users on your site, NOT ONE CLIP was of a bike rider doing a trick. Out of a total of 552 photos on your site of your parks and users performing tricks at your parks, ONLY ONE PHOTOGRAPH featured a bike rider. ONE PHOTO? What a slap in the face. You may as well just take it down, Wormhoudt. You’re just ridiculing us now. If you want, I can show you how to Photoshop out all of the background riders in your parks, making them look completely bike-free. Also, out of all the endorsements on your site, NOT ONE was written by a BMX rider. Suspicious. I know for a fact that at one point SDG was looking for an endorsement from Mat Hoffman, but he REFUSED to give it until every one of their skateparks allowed bikes. That’s probably why you can’t get any BMX rider or BMX industry endorsements either.
What kind of message do you think your website sends to parks and rec officials who are looking at it, considering hiring your company to design their skatepark? You don’t even have to tell them they shouldn’t allow bikes (which I am convinced you do anyways) because the site says it all without saying it. I know how skatepark designers work. I have proof that Colby Carter, when he worked for SDG, tried many times to convince Jim McCasland, Director of Prescott Parks and Recreation Department, not to allow bikes in Prescott’s new skatepark. Thankfully Jim did tons of his own research on the issue, and chose to completely ignore Colby’s decidedly biased and discriminatory opinion.
I’d appreciate it if you would stop trying to take credit because a city happened to overrule your opinions and allowed bikes anyways. And paying off a couple bike pros does not you a “bike friendly” designer make. SDG paid an Arizona pro thousands of dollars for his input on the Tuba City Skatepark, and Colby Carter ignored every bit of it in the design. The whole thing was just lip service, and I believe that’s what you’re doing with your bike rider payoffs.
Now, on to the main course. In the City of Tempe Skate Park Facility Report of Opinion you made concerning the skatepark’s bicycle durability in 2005, you deemed the Tempe Skatepark STRUCTURALLY INCAPABLE of handling bike use.
Early on in the report, you told the city council that “Pool coping is usually constructed of high strength concrete and is installed with high strength mortar.” Funny thing is, not only is the pool coping in the Tempe Skatepark NOT made of high strength concrete, it IS made of pool coping purchased from a SWIMMING POOL COPING MANUFACTURER. It is NOT designed for skatepark use in any way, shape or form! It IS soft limestone crap that is EASILY DAMAGED. Since swimming pool coping is so weak, why on earth did you ever design your Benecia park with AN ENTIRE POOL LINED WITH SOFT SWIMMING POOL COPING, well knowing that it would allow bikes from the start? Notwithstanding this fact, you admit in your report that pool coping is “able to be replaced.” Right there, your statement takes the “pool coping rationale” away from keeping bikes out of the Tempe Skatepark. If the coping is damaged, whether by bikes, skateboards, or by looking at it (which is hardly far-fetched), it can be easily replaced.
Later in your report, you blame bikes for the bulk of “damage” to concrete surfaces when you say, “Damage to the concrete as a result of park use is limited but does occur in some instances. Scratches, chips, gouges, and excessive wear are forms of damage that can occur in skate parks. These types of damage are usually associated with bicycle use.” How convenient for you that you never mentioned the big patches of chipped concrete that are regularly found at the bottom of inclined rails and at the bottom of ledges that skaters routinely ollie off of. Many times when skaters come off the rail or ledge and don’t land the trick, the extremely strong tool steel axles of the skateboard jam into the concrete and chip it.
Also in your report, in referring to bike pegs, you say, “Bicycle pegs are usually made of hardened steel. As a result, bike pegs grinding on steel coping causes damage to the coping, whereas the trucks of a skateboard are made of aluminum and are actually damaged by riding the steel coping.” You fail to mention, again, that kingpins, which many times stick out from a skateboard’s aluminum trucks, are made of Grade 8 hardness bolts, which are even harder than most hardened steel pegs. These kingpins dig into the coping during grinds, causing gouges and scratches, just like the bike pegs do. Notwithstanding this fact, you have designed Louisville and Benecia, both skateparks that have allowed bikes from the start, with Schedule 40 steel pipe coping, which is the exact same steel coping used in Tempe’s skatepark.
You go on to claim in your report that “Most parks that are designed to allow for bicycle use include special details to increase the durability of the park. The steel coping is usually detailed such that it has an increased wall thickness and includes a steel plate that runs beyond the pipe coping (or in the case of steel tubing, that is wide enough) to prevent the bike pegs from touching the adjacent concrete.” Where then, sir, is the steel plate that runs beyond the pipe coping in Louisville? Doesn’t Louisville Skatepark, designed from the start for bike use, also have 2” Schedule 40 steel pipe coping just like the Tempe Skatepark?
Then you claim in your report that “Concrete pool coping is typically not specified in skate parks where bike use is anticipated.” Is that a fact? Again, why then does Benecia, a park that YOU designed and has been open to bikes from the very beginning, have SOFT CRAPPY LIMESTONE POOL COPING in it?
In your report, you conclude that “…it is my professional opinion that the skate park was not designed to accommodate bike use. The steel coping in the skate park was not detailed for bicycle use. However, the park does include a significant amount of concrete pool coping, not typical in parks designed for bicycle use. And the park has numerous grindable edges (exposed concrete) with no coping at all. These three factors are key indicators that the park was not designed for bike use. Allowing bike use in the park will more than likely result in excessive damage to the coping and the concrete surfaces. The predictable damage will be difficult and expensive to repair and will significantly reduce the riding experience for park users.” So what you are saying, is that although YOU designed Louisville and Benecia Skateparks, fully knowing that they would allow bikes from the very beginning, with 2” Schedule 40 steel coping, JUST LIKE TEMPE’S STEEL COPING, magically the Tempe Skatepark can’t handle bikes. And you are also saying that although you designed Benecia Skatepark with AN ENTIRE POOL lined with soft limestone pool coping JUST LIKE TEMPE SKATEPARKS’ SOFT LIMESTONE POOL COPING, fully knowing that it would allow bikes from the very beginning, somehow the Tempe Skatepark can’t handle bikes. And lastly, although you designed Louisville Skatepark and Benecia Skatepark, fully knowing that they would allow bikes from the very beginning, with some exposed concrete edges with no edge treatment, JUST LIKE TEMPE SKATEPARKS’ EXPOSED CONCRETE EDGES; incredibly the Tempe Skatepark can’t handle bikes.
So that’s it. I believe you have now been proven, point by point, A BOLD-FACED LIAR. I didn’t even have to mention that NOT ONE of your claims of bikes causing more damage than skateboards on pool coping, steel coping and exposed edges are COMPLETELY UNSUBSTANTIATED and have not ONE SHRED of empirical data to support them. Where are your facts? Where’s your hard evidence? Where’s your five year study?
HERE are some rock-solid facts: In Arizona, the bike-friendly skateparks of Mesa, Glendale, Fountain Hills, Prescott, Prescott Valley, Arivaca, Sierra Vista, Marana, Bullhead City and Tuba City, and the bikeparks of Flagstaff and Chandler have been holding up just fine. These cities are more than happy that they don’t have to kick bikes out, and that they were able to accommodate their bmx-riding citizens’ needs by giving them places to ride. All these parks have some exposed edges, they all have Schedule 40 steel coping (or thinner), and very few have steel plating behind the coping. None have crappy limestone pool coping, which YOU thought was a great idea for Benecia’s bike-friendly skatepark.
Now you said in your post, “Frustration with not being able to use all of the skateparks out there is one thing, but to blame the park designers for the park rules is only going to further limit your places to ride.” Is that an ultimatum? Are you threatening me for doing whatever I can to get cities to give just as equitable treatment to kids who ride bikes as they do to kids who ride skateboards? Don’t patronize ME, YOU ASSHOLE!!! NOBODY tells ME how to be an effective activist except trusted friends!
California riders: Wormhoudt sold Tempe residents out when he made his report to Tempe City Council on the “bike-worthiness” of our skatepark. I believe he is biased against bike riders in skateparks, and his report was influenced by Colby Carter’s hatred for bike riders as well. Watch out for Wormhoudt, because he can easily do the same to you.
Good luck convincing any city in Arizona to allow you to design their skatepark, Wormhoudt. WE control the process now, and we know how to keep scumbags like you out of it. I call a liar a liar. And I sincerely believe that you, sir, are a liar. I also think you are steeped in blatant contradictions and hypocrisy. Why don’t you now explain to everybody how exactly you’re not lying about this issue every single day?
The floor is yours, you dirty little Wormhoudt.
Jason Ryan
President
The Bike, Blade and Board Coalition
Posted by psychicflyingmonkey![[TypeKey Profile Page]](http://www.sfbg.com/blogs/gsf/nav-commenters.gif)
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July 2, 2008 09:36 AM
Zach Wormhoudt writes:
"The truth is a City and the City's Insurance Provider determine if bikes will be allowed in parks, not the park designer."
Yeah, and there's this general in Nigeria who insists he is trying to move money out of the country and will let me have some of it if I send him my bank account info
Also, there's this bridge in Brooklyn for sale
Homeopathic brain transplant?
Posted by pipelineaudio | July 11, 2008 03:44 PM
Hi Jason,
You are giving us bikers a bad name bud.
Get some sleep my friend.
Next time re-read your venom before hitting POST. Any attempt you made at getting your point accross was lost in all the angry blather.
You do not speak for any biker, blader or boarder I know.
Carry on.
J.N.
Posted by Jerrad Nicols | September 2, 2008 06:33 PM
Dear Mr. Monkey,
Your response to Mr. W. was unprovoked. He provided a professional response to the general public. You provided a waste of time, and alienation.
If bikes are to ever be allowed into parks, we must ALL work together to make that dream a reality.
I moved from the SF Bay to FL. Now, I have nothing to ride. Your situation is really not that bad.
~Cole
Posted by Cole Nielsen-Cole | October 5, 2008 05:45 AM