She's representing her constituents and not the left-wing editorial staff at The Guardian - why do you find that so "astonishing?"

Seems to me that the "renegades" here would be the school board for ignoring the will of the voters when they voted last November overwhelmingly in favor of keeping JROTC in San Francisco high schools.

Get real, Petra and Shane. Our school board members were elected to make policy decisions for the district. That is their duty and their responsibility. Their positions on JROTC were well-known.

Prop V was a fraud. It was a political and financial vehicle for downtown to bash the campaigns of Eric Mar, John Avalos and David Chieu for the Board of Supervisors. There are legal restrictions on how much money downtown could put directly into the campaigns of its favored candidates, but no limit on how much money they could put into proposition campaigns like V. So they poured $200,000 into the "No on V" campaign, and used it to bash Mar, Avalos and Chieu with a slew of innuendo, lies and slander.

Despite downtown's frenzied efforts, Mar, Avalos and Chieu were all elected. Chieu is now President of the Board.

The "No on V" campaign was outspent 15-1. If we had had even half the money that the "Yes on V" campaign had, we would have won. In 2005, nearly 60% of San Franciscans voted to kick the military recruiters out of our schools.

Now the downtown crowd is using JROTC to try to bash the progressive members of the school board. They are still trying to take back control of San Francisco politics, like the "good old days" when the "good old boys" ran the show.

We should be proud of our "renegade" school board members who are standing up for what is right for our youth, standing up for principle, and refusing to front for downtown and the military like Jill Wynns and Rachel Norton.

And Gefiltefish should look to the east, say around Montgomery Street.

The "good old boys" downtown who funded of Prop V were the Committee on Jobs ($110k), the SF Chamber of Commerce ($20.5k), Donald Fisher ($20k), Plan C ($10k), PG&E ($7.5k), and the SF Association of Realtors ($7.5k).

As Dylan said, money doesn't talk, it swears.

I love how commenters and writers on this site throw around the term "downtown" to encompass everything they hate. Do you know there's actually a city called San Francisco that exists outside of the Haight, Castro, Noe Valley and Mission? Look to your West, South, Southeast, etc.

To H. Brown:

Yeah, I would get mad too if you said the "Jewish Cabal." Cut out the anti-Semitism. It ain't funny.

While you are at it, lay off the "tin soldiers" crap. The JROTC youth aren't the perps, they are the victims.

It is not just the Bay Guardian that supports SERV. It has nearly unanimous support. But it won't empty JROTC all by itself, and that is why JROTC should end in June.

Warren Hellman gave $2,500, not $20,000. Do your reading when you are sober, Brown, if ever.

campers,

I used to say 'Jewish Cabal' instead of 'Downtown' but people got all pissed off. I'm serious, they did.

JROTC is lame. Restricting their training to parade protocol insults the intelligence of the students. The President with his National Service Corps has a better idea. Homeland Security has a better idea. Hell, even the Board of Education has a better idea (SERV). Only the Bay Guardian supports the new program. The Chron and the Examiner prefer to march in circles.

I predict that Norman Yee (absent again from Select Committee yesterday) will rollover and vote for JROTC but that the SERV classes will shortly leave the tin soldiers classes empty.

And, incidentally, the first 20k for Prop V was provided by a guy named Warren Hellman. Subsequent donor lists deleted his name. Why's that?

h.

Hey Norton,

They are a cabal. Don't care if you don't like it. The Irish have one too. Called the RBA. The Chinese have their Tongs and try wearing the wrong color on 24th and Mission. Ever hear of the Mafia? I'll criticize each and every group in the hope that their own communities will rein them in. You're wrong on the Hellman donation too. You following the demonstration (underway as I write) at the Art Institute? Hellman took it over a few years back, cut the Board of Directors by 40%, instituted strict censorship and this week announced he's dumping the 25% of the faculty he considers to not be partinost. Ask the founder of the Haight-Ashbury Free Clinic what happened when Hellman got control of his board. Oh, wait, you can't cause Hellman fired him. The man controls every major entertainment venue in town and is moving to grab control of the last daily newspaper. I don't care what color or religion he is, it all alarms me.

I apologize to the JROTC cadets. The line ("on the bloody morning after one tin soldier rides away") comes from 'Billy Jack'. They'll do well on SERV and can actually provide meaningful service when emergencies hit.

Your personal insults excite me. I've read your work in the anti-JROTC effort and I had no idea you were personally so coarse. If you can get a little lower I just might invite you over for a brew.

h.

h.

To both Timid and Norton,

How did Norton read my comments sent before they were posted? You have my comments from the morning logged after 2:30pm and have Norton commenting on them BEFORE they should have been public knowledge.

Timid, Timid, Timid ... are you ganging up this poor senior citizen? Note to the wise, get more in-your-pocket posters. I can take down an army of your wimps before breakfast.

h.

guys!!

I'm waiting. How did Norton know what my comments were an hour and a half before you posted them? I posted them through your encrypted system and they shouldn't have been accessible to the general population.

Comments, Timid? Bruce? Jones?

h.

Brownie, the clock on your computer may be screwed up. Or it may not match Norton's. believe me, we're ganging up on you in much more intelligent ways than sockpuppeting.

Yeah, what Marke said. Sometimes comments don't post in the exact order they were sent. Nothing mysterious, no conspiracies here.

thanks boys,

And, Norton, I shouldn't bait you. I'm just sorry there are so few of us dialoguing. You put up great columns all through the week and it seems no one reads them. Sad.

For a good read go to the Contra Costa times and read the comments on yesterday's column by their political editor, Lisa Vorderbrueggen (4-4-09) on the race for Tauscher's seat in Congress. She failed to mention the candidacy of Adriel Hampton and boy, does he have lots of friends.

h.

Norton gets his facts wrong, as usual.

Prop V passed because working-class kids in the program took to the streets and walked precincts in order to keep their program going.

JROTC is very popular among Asian and Latin American immigrants. There are openly gay students in the program. The principals at all seven high schools with JROTC programs support it.

Norman Yee is now a supporter because he is listening to his constituents (immigrant parents) instead of the the Guardian's largely white, middle-class, and childless readers.